4 replies to this topic

[Devon Anderson]

okay... a coupla gripes!!!!! :-()

Try importing a dialog that has conflicting (same name) properties for the radiobutton group. watch as, even if you rename your buttongroups, when you want to add or edit or delete, your whole project becomes extinct because the compiler cannot add a radiobutton that does not exist to a dialog's radiobutton group. (Need a detailed example, mail me). Watch as you have to send your whole project to IS for them to remove the orphaned radio button from the project using a tool that they wont release.

layering anyone? watch as you try to control the layering order of your overlapping controls. you cant. well, you can change the "order" of a radiobutton in a radiobutton group, but thats not to do with layering!!  try putting an underlying backgroup bitmap under text/etc in the dialog. this wont work... hey, maybe it looks good in the IDE, then run it. layering order is out the Window (pun intended).

but probably you tried to do this because you also noticed you couldnt set the background colour of any of the dialogs. its hardcoded to the windows color scheme. hmm.

watch as even if you manage to get your component ordering right for the layers (using say Visual C and importing the dialog via a DLL resource), or by creating the dialog entirely from scratch again (OUCH, now i have to do ALL THE CA / button links AGAIN!) and relying on the order they were put on the dialog (too bad if you want to insert anything into the order), then see what happens if one of these is a radiobuttongroup --- you cant set the radiobutton to transparent. only the group... so nice radiobutton with a big square of grey sitting around it.

try removing the InstallShield logo and line from ISWI .... you can hide it in InstallShield 5/6 but , sorry, we remove that capability in WIndows Installer... suckers! Try dropping a bitmap over it to hide it. Sorry.. remember the ordering problems???????? so its off to the String Table to hack around and see if you can change it to empty strings....

basically InstallShield for Windows Installer is not customizable!!! i would have been better off writing my own installer and saved time. What is the deal? is this a product for developers or what??????

couple in all the crashes i get when running two copies of installer, or when i have a complicated dialog and try moving/resizing controls... its BAD.

anyone have any comments? or am i just having bad luck and not using documented workarounds? in which case, i apologise... but you know, both the knowledge base and the online help suck too. But seriously, perhaps im not looking properly for the workarounds.

by the way... I tried using installscript SetColor but it didnt change the color.

what to do.....

cheers,
Devon

[Ian Blake]

I mostly agree with you although your complaint about background colour is probably a limitation of windows installer.

I believe that the IDE is a shameful piece of code.  Not because it is bad, we all make amazing errors, but because it is still bad.   Many of the problems with the IDE have been present for several versions of ISWI.  

You missed a few faults.  It does not always remember changes you have made (very very anoying).  It is not always WYSIWYG eg. it displays a rectangle rather that a group box for a group box making it difficult to align things easily.  It creates properties for controls even for controls such as static text that do not use properties. Deleting a string from the string table for a bitmap can make the dialog undisplayable. etc. etc.

I agree the radio button problem is particularly nasty.  Fortunately I have learned enough about the .ISV file (A do no edit file) to be able to remove them with a good text editor.

Is anybody willing to defend InstallShield's IDE?

[Dave I]

I agree and sympathise with both of your comments guys, the Dialog editor truely is a hideous mess.  The installation I am authoring requires 50+ dialogs.  The task of creating a complex UI sequence literally drove me to drink....

The difficulty in creating a dialog template; The radiobutton fiasco; Controls that move when you select them; Setting tab order only to leave the dialog, come back and they are all set to 17!!!  In general its ISWI's inability to do the simple tasks taken for granted that causes the most frustration.

Eg. Failing to Save changes, Allowing multiple selection of rows in tables but deletion of only one at a time.  

I  dont know what they created ISWI with but just look at the Microsoft VB/VC++ dialog editors their virtually flawless in comparison, even better rip the ISWI Dialog editor out and support resource files fully.

I passed the point of fighting long ago I no longer swear or curse I just accept that its deficiencies.

On a more humorous note my personal favourite is the line control which creates a random coloured box when dragged.  A piccasoesque dialog feature, nice!!!

Yes, it is a technology in its infancy but you hit the nail on the head Ian, the worrying thing is that they are yet to acknowledge the problems.  Maybe all the problems will be fixed in the new version but...  

[80LPJ]

I agree that  the IDE is not  that good at all.  Additionally, once you're one-month warranty expire from the date of purchase,  InstallShield expects to be paid for supporting problems that may arise from using their IDE.  

I am grateful that Stefan created this site so people can exchange ideas on how to work with this software product.

[Stefan Krueger]

About the layering problem:
Windows Installer paints controls in tab order, but first those with tab stop, then those without tab stop. So in addition to give your background bitmap a low tab order number, make sure it has tab stop set. (That's one of the many quirks in the Windows Installer engine)